Summary of Coffee Compiler Club, 2022_09_23

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00:00:00 - 01:00:00

The Coffee Compiler Club video discusses how to make a self-hosted compiler that is easy to use and does not rely on callbacks. They also mention how to avoid thread stealing and how to ensure that pinned processes are always scheduled on the pin thread.

00:00:00 The presenter discusses a dependency management system in which you specify a minimum required version and the compiler system tries to pick the highest minimum version. He also talks about how major versions are different packages and how to convert between versions.
00:05:00 The author discusses how multiple major versions of the same library can cause dependency headaches. He argues that bumping the own major version of the library would solve the issue.
00:10:00 The coffee compiler club video explains the need for dependencies in software development, and how to manage them to keep dependencies as few as possible. The Rust language and its package manager are used as an example, but the concepts can be applied to other languages.
00:15:00 Caleb discusses the benefits and drawbacks of having a split between a package manager and a compiler. He argues that the benefits are there if somebody at some point finds out that the standard package manager doesn't work. He also argues that it makes offline building easier because if he has the dependency, he can just run his builds and not have to give like some offline flag to tell it not to go to the internet.
00:20:00 The Coffee Compiler Club discusses the pros and cons of self-hosting a compiler for a language. They discuss that in order for self-hosting to be effective, the compiler needs to be written in the language itself, and that this is only possible for languages that are gaining popularity. They say that the community that likes writing in a language is more likely to contribute to a compiler if it is hosted by the language itself.
00:25:00 In this video, GitHub founder and CEO Tom Preston-Werner discusses the company's decision to move away from Java and implement their new language in C. He says that this process of bootstrapping becomes "absolute" once a new language is implemented. He also points out that Java did not have any advantages over C in the long term, and that the type-level project High used a restricted version of Python to achieve the same goals.
00:30:00 The Coffee Compiler Club discusses the importance of focusing on the language and compiler development rather than worrying about hosting and runtime issues. They believe that this is a better approach because the language itself is well-suited to writing compilers, and the compiler is bad at everything else.
00:35:00 In the video, Rob Pike and Ken Thompson discuss the importance of languages for different purposes. 40 years ago, developers needed to use a different language for each task, but now there are more appropriate options. Async await is a new language feature that is important, but orthogonal to self-hosting. Foreign languages can be difficult to write, but with a focus on making them easy to use, they can be successful.
00:40:00 The Coffee Compiler Club discusses how different languages handle events, with Elm standing out as having a more efficient approach. Elm also allows for fine-grained slicing of events, which is an advantage over languages that have a synchronous or asynchronous approach.
00:45:00 In this YouTube video, the Coffee Compiler Club discusses how to make a programming language feature that allows the programmer to block the entire thread while reading a file. They also mention that this feature should be easy to use and convenient to write.
00:50:00 The Coffee Compiler Club video discusses the asynchronous nature of languages such as JavaScript and Erlang, and how this can lead to problems. The author discusses a solution to this by implementing a "blocking" mechanism for different operations.
00:55:00 Coffee compiler club discusses how to make a self-hosted compiler that is easy to use and does not rely on callbacks. They also mention how to avoid thread stealing and how to ensure that pinned processes are always scheduled on the pin thread.

01:00:00 - 02:00:00

The Coffee Compiler Club discusses ways to handle complex data structures and improve the efficiency of their code. They suggest using a thread pool and scheduling to improve responsiveness, and using lazy functions to quickly read data from files. They also argue that the current abstraction for micro-threading, the Io micro-ring, is not the right abstraction for a language to code to.

01:00:00 The Coffee Compiler Club discusses how complex data structures can be in a language like Java, and how a compiler can help to ensure correctness. They suggest that ideally, data structures would be written in the language itself, and that C programmers should use functions that don't insert scheduling instructions.
01:05:00 The Coffee Compiler Club video discusses the need for a cheaper, more efficient way to deal with multi-threaded programming. They note that there are no truly "anybody in the other" when it comes to threading paradigms, but that the "graph always looks Greener" when one side is moved. They suggest that the overhead costs of different threading approaches may be prohibitive, and that escape routes may be available.
01:10:00 The Coffee Compiler Club discusses how different platforms can have different costs and performance when spawning threats. It also looks at how OS threads can be limiting on Windows, and how a production platform can be chosen.
01:15:00 In this video, the Coffee Compiler Club discusses how they are trying to improve the responsiveness of their applications by using a thread pool and scheduling. They also mention how there is currently no publicly well understood API that all applications adhere to that determines how high priority a thread will be.
01:20:00 The video discusses the Coffee Compiler Club's 2022 goal of coming up with a way to efficiently handle multi-threaded async bulk throughput. They discuss the idea of using an "async taking Anonymous function" to avoid having to spawn threads, and how this would improve the performance of the code. They also discuss the idea of gathering promises and launching them all at once, which would make the code much more efficient.
01:25:00 The video discusses a possible future data ecosystem in which lazy functions are used to quickly read data from files, without having to wait for the data to be completely read. This would allow for more efficient use of resources and could be more efficient than the current H2O model, without all the internal overhead.
01:30:00 In this video, the Coffee Compiler Club discusses the idea of creating "apis for specific use cases." They argue that the current abstraction for micro-threading, the Io micro-ring, is not the right abstraction for a language to code to. They suggest that a new language level API be created to manage the work list of the micro-threading kernel, instead.
01:35:00 In this video, Simon Sinek discusses the future of coffee and how coffee compilers are changing the way coffee is made. He also talks about the future of futures and how they can be used to improve the performance of certain tasks.
01:40:00 In this video, the Coffee Compiler Club members discuss the Future API, which is a complicated API that is infecting everything from their perspective. They also discuss the types of futures, and how to make sure that the return type of a future is correctly typed.
01:45:00 The video discusses how to write code to achieve a desired outcome using a coffee compiler club. The presenter explains that you can achieve the same goal using different syntaxes, but provides an example of how to do it using sequential code.
01:50:00 The video explains how Coffee Compiler Club is using futures to improve the sequential code. The club is looking for ways to shorten up the code, and moving the get so that it is in the same place where it is being used as an argument would be a good solution.
01:55:00 The Coffee Compiler Club discusses ways to handle future errors in an INT. One solution is to propagate the error up through the task, but this can be awkward because the throws from different threads may be far apart. Another solution is to block the Future when it throws, but this can be expensive. A third solution is to pick up the throws from the thread where the Future was created.

02:00:00 - 02:35:00

The Coffee Compiler Club meets to discuss their 2022 project and how to overcome various errors they are encountering. They also discuss the importance of cancellation in programming and how it can impact non-canceled work. Finally, they mention the Club's cancellation and plans for the future.

02:00:00 The video discusses Coffee Compiler Club's 2022 project, which is to create a compiler that can automatically recover from errors by invoking another computation. The project's default behavior is to fail if a past task fails, but the presenter shows an example of how to change the default behavior so that if a past task succeeds, Roselawn (a side-chain compiler) will also fail.
02:05:00 The Coffee Compiler Club discusses the error that is the current theory on it. They discuss how a value can be of type A or dot dot dot dot. They also discuss a future that says a type that if called block will give back the a by either calling the function or returning the result. Finally, they discuss how the done flag needs to be checked before getting the result and how the API for the done and git needs to be anything more than just done.
02:10:00 The video discusses the complexities of Coffee Compiler Club's 2020 deadline and how the use of futures and promises can add to the complexity of code. The speaker suggests that, in order to make futures and promises more usable, Coffee Compiler Club should provide a simpler API that separates the cost of execution from the cost of creating futures and promises.
02:15:00 The video discusses how Coffee Compiler Club members sequentially one after another, and that's how you end up with combinators in languages like JavaScript. The idea is that it's cheap to spawn a thread, because you block and it comes back to you. However, there is no thread underneath, and it's inefficient because you have to do all the work in the main thread. A better approach would be to have a lazy operator that takes three things to run in parallel, and the order in which they are executed is not guaranteed.
02:20:00 The Coffee Compiler Club discusses how to better compose lazy functions. They come up with a way to use function composition and lazy to create a 'lazy future' that can be canceled if needed.
02:25:00 The video discusses the importance of cancellation in programming, and how it can negatively impact non-canceled work. It also explains how to invoke cancel in a task scheduling system.
02:30:00 The video discusses a problem with canceling future tasks in a parallel environment. The problem is that when a future is canceled, the thread that is doing the work needs to know about the cancel tree in order to be able to cancel its future. This can be a difficult task to implement, as the user of the future body may not have designed the body to deal with cancels.
02:35:00 The video discusses the Coffee Compiler Club, which was canceled due to lack of attendance. The presenter discusses progress he has made on his sea of nodes implementation, and plans to show it off next time. He also mentions that he has optimizations to do for the next meeting.